Jamison Thies of Snows Down Low

Pictures Courtesy of Jamison and Snows Down Low

SR: Who is Jamison Thies? What do you do? And how did you get to where you are today?

Thies: I’m Jamison Thies, owner of Snows Down Low. Snows Down Low has been in business since January 2015. I have also been a contract website developer since 2001, which makes me a pretty old guy I guess, but it has allowed me to experience a lot of different technology which influences some aspects of Snows Down Low and gives us unique capabilities. And last but not least, I have been an automotive and diesel mechanic for almost 30 years, but I don’t do much of that anymore these days. I was fortunate to develop my mechanic skills alongside my father who was a world-class certified mechanic. All of that experience has contributed to developing different talents and skill-sets that we utilize in creative and innovative ways to build some pretty cool snow goose hunting products.

SR: What gave you the idea to create Snows Down Low? 

Thies: The whole thing started back in February of 2013 when I was hunting with my 15-yr old nephew. We went out for an afternoon hunt on a pasture-pond setup. We were using I think Snows on the Prairie or Snow-Bait on the e-caller. Those were sort of the standard snow goose hunting e-caller tracks at that time. So we’re using those tracks, and we’re having a bit of success. It wasn’t a big push day or anything, it was just a typical migration day. So we’re set up on the water spread with some decoys up the hill in a typical loafing setup, and there are some birds on the horizon but it’s getting really close to the end of legal shooting light which is 30 minutes after sunset during conservation season, so it gets pretty well dark by then. The birds keep coming but they’re not going to make it over the decoys in time for legal shooting light. So I tell him “Hey we’re done, it’s too late, we can’t shoot at these” which of course got a bit of disappointment from him as would be expected from most 15-yr olds that are excited to shoot. So we put our guns down and we just let the birds come in and they light on the water right in front of the blind not even 10 feet away from us. They didn’t have a care in the world, they had no idea we were there, just because it was so dark. We’re like ‘this is pretty cool’ just being able to be this close to the birds. Then we heard the geese start making the weirdest noises that we’d never heard before. Things like snoring sounds, and grunts and burps and chirps and all these odd sounds, and we were like ‘man that’s really unique, we should record that and try to make an e-caller track out of it and see what happens’. So, we did.

We sat there for at least an hour in the dark and just recorded these birds. I went home that night, downloaded the recordings onto the computer, and edited up a really raw, rough track. We went out that next day or that next weekend and it was incredible the difference we saw in the birds and how they reacted to the e-caller – like flipping a switch they started to decoy with the commitment we had not seen before. I don’t know if that was because of our new track, or because of the birds or conditions that day, but we started using that track during the rest of our hunts that season and had pretty consistent improved success. Now it’s not fair to say that a single track will always make a substantial improvement in the birds or your hunting – it’s not a magic wand – but sounds and tracks are a big factor in your success. Having the right sounds, and quality sounds for the location and conditions you’re hunting is pretty important. So we used it that season, and the next season, and we thought, ‘You know what? Let’s release it and see what happens’. So I edited up 5 tracks total, and we launched in January of 2015 with our first CD. The response was really good and there was a lot of demand, people were excited about these new tracks, and it took off. It was fun to sell a few CDs or downloads, but what became fulfilling for us is to hear how we helped somebody have a better hunt because of something we did. The most enjoyable part of that first year was seeing people going out there, using our stuff, and having a lot of success with it. Helping somebody to have a better time out in the field means a lot to us. That’s what started it for us and we’ve just kept rolling from there.

SR: Where does the name “Snows Down Low” come from?

Thies: It was partially inspired by a hip-hop or country (or some combination) song my nephew picked up from somewhere. He suggested “down low” as something to go off of, and I was like ‘Well, we do get the snows down low with these new tracks’. It really did make them get pretty stupid, and they were getting lower than ever before; like hitting the tops of our blinds sorta stuff. They started committing with reckless abandon with these tracks. So we thought, ‘Alright, Snows Down Low. Sounds good’ and that’s what it ended up being.

SR: What was the hardest part of getting into the snow goose hunting industry?

Thies: The snow goose hunting industry is very niche. I mean, waterfowl, in general, is niche but snow goose hunting is an even smaller niche, only being a fraction of duck and goose hunters overall. Getting into the industry was more of a timely opportunity than anything else. There was a gap in the market for fresh, new e-caller sounds at that time, so we identified that and fulfilled that gap with fresh and crispy tracks that worked well, which initially got our foot in the door of the industry. Growing and sustaining a business in the industry can be difficult, though. You have to understand the niche you’re in, and you have to relate to the people who are so passionate about hunting these birds. You have to offer real value and something that will help guys be more successful. Being a dedicated snow goose hunter is such a grind, and you often lose more times than you win. The guys who do it, do it because they love it. Because they’ve been involved in an incredible experience while hunting snows. It’s very much a passion, and even addiction in a way, to chase that kind of experience again. The guys out there grinding need quality equipment and we’re working to fill that need, listening to and applying feedback of guys putting in 100+ days a year, and we’re constantly moving forward. No days off!

SR: What makes an e-caller a successful tool to use in the field?

Thies: The biggest thing that the e-caller brings to the field is its ability to closely mimic the sound and loudness of a large number of birds. Trying to do that with a mouth call is ridiculous. Even if you have a lot of guys out there, it’s still extremely hard to sound like a big flock of snows. Volume has proven over and over to be effective at turning distant birds or stopping migrators. You want clarity from your e-caller, nice sharp sounds, and that’s a result of how the call is designed and built, and the quality of the sounds going into the call. Electronic calls are an awesome tool and when a quality e-caller with clear sounds is used to its full potential it can be a game-changer in helping guys harvest more snow geese.

SR: What’s the most effective way that you’ve been able to get realistic sounds for your e-callers?

Thies: The best and most effective way for me to capture our realistic sounds is to go directly to the source, which is the geese themselves. I’ve been able to record sounds from wild geese as they make their way through southeast Nebraska and the Midwest during the migration. Around here there are a lot of corn and bean fields and small ponds, so I’ve taken the opportunity to go out to those locations and record the geese. For example, I’ll have permission on a pond to hunt it, so I go out there and set up decoys, like the time with my nephew, and we have the opportunity to hunt but also have the opportunity to capture interesting recordings of the birds, and so we do. That time with my nephew was also a great opportunity to teach a young hunter that you don’t always have to shoot to have fun or be successful, you can simply just enjoy the experience of being around that many geese and being that close to nature.

An important aspect of our tracks is knowing what the birds were doing when they’re making the sounds that they did while I was capturing the recordings. Birds feeding could be relaxed or could be aggressive. Birds on the water could be active or half-asleep. Are they trying to survive on a limited resource such as food, or are they being social and resting? I’ve even crawled in ditches for hours to get closer to birds, sometimes just to observe and learn. Every situation is unique. Anybody can download sounds from the Internet and make a track, and that track will probably work to some extent, but because I’ve spent the time and observed the bird behavior, and I’ve been there and captured these recordings first-hand, I’m able to put together the number of birds in the environment, exactly how they sounded, and then make an authentic, realistic track from the recordings. It’s really boots on the ground and bellies in the ditch type of stuff to record these birds in a way that gets us clean, 100% unique recordings of the sounds they make that are then crafted to provide a specific result in a track.

SR: What’s the craziest thing you’ve ever had to do to get a recording of snow geese?

Thies: Crawling through snowy or muddy ditches is about as crazy as it gets. The geese keep hopping around while they’re feeding and I have to stay low, so, for the most part, it’s just a face full of grass or snow or whatever. They’re not all bad though, crawling the ditches is pretty much the worst of it.

SR: What are the 3 most important things you need to do to effectively utilize an e-caller?

Thies: Number one is to have an idea of how much sound your decoy spread would normally create. If you have 200 decoys in your spread, you don’t need a lot of sound, if you have a 2,000 decoy spread, you’re going to need more sound. Spread size plays into the track selection as well. You probably don’t want to play something rambunctious if you only have 200 decoys out there. You can get away with having less sound and a bigger spread, though. That’s one thing that isn’t a direct linear relationship. If you have birds working a smaller spread and you’re going crazy with the e-caller, and you’re going too loud or you’re playing some kind of really noisy or active track, chances are the birds are going to feel that’s unnatural, which can bug them out. Matching your sounds to your spread and conditions is usually pretty important.

Number two is to have good sound distribution. When you play the wind, you have to know that wind will blow sound around and affect how it travels. You have to be aware of that and adjust your speakers accordingly. Also, if you have a huge spread, you should have sound throughout the spread. If you only have sound in one area, it’s not going to be as natural. You want to make your spread as natural as possible, and you want to have sound distribution throughout your spread with a louder, more focused area right around the gunners. That can be accomplished with multiple e-callers, or it can be accomplished with horn speakers. We primarily use horn speakers because their sound distribution angle is very wide and they efficiently replicate all the frequencies of the snow goose sounds. We went an entire season with a 4-speaker call and a horn speaker on each corner of the pit blind, with each speaker pointing 90 degrees from the others covering all 360 degrees. The speakers were pointed flat across the ground and we never had to touch them. Birds worked perfectly.

Number three is probably the most difficult, but you have to be able to read the birds. Just like you hunt ducks or you hunt honkers, there are times when you want more volume and lean harder on the call, and there are times when you want less volume so you go softer on the call. You can use an e-caller on circling snows just like you would a duck call on mallards. You can turn the volume up, and hit them on the corners and have them come back with a little more interest. A good rule of thumb is that you want to be able to hear the birds over the e-caller. That is just a guideline, just because every day and every situation is different. The wind and all other little things have an effect, there’s a lot of variables, but it’s a good starting point. You may have to adjust as the day goes on. Let the birds tell you how high or low to have the volume and which tracks to play. That’s only gained by experience.

Bonus tip: Sound clarity is very important, but it won’t help if you don’t have your volume set correctly, your speakers setup correctly, or if you can’t read the birds to use the e-caller to communicate effectively. Do all of those things with clear sounds and you’ll good to go.

SR: How do you find the right balance between e-caller and how many decoys in your spread?

Thies: The short answer is: it depends. Every situation is different and can change with the weather, which is definitely an important variable. For example, creating your setup to mimic a small feed of 800-1,000 decoys in a cornfield on a sunny day might be more relaxed versus the same feed on a cloudy day with some weather rolling in that evening which would usually be a more urgent and necessary feeding situation for the birds. Another consideration is if you’re targeting migrators or chasing feeds you might need more or less sound. Birds hitting a feed probably don’t need quite as much persuading with sound as they do when they’re migrating what seems like a mile-high when you have to change their mind on where they want to be.

Finding that perfect setup will be different in Canada than it would be in Nebraska or Arkansas, so it’s important to spend time scouting and learning how birds typically act in the area you’re hunting and how the day’s weather will affect them. Set realistic spreads for the location and conditions, then choose the best call for the situation. The e-caller volume and track selection should reflect the conditions to ideally create what geese would see as realistic for the given location and conditions.

We’re often asked which e-caller would be best. The recommendation we suggest often relies on how you intend to hunt as we’ve discussed, but field access is always a big consideration. The Overkill HD is our biggest, most powerful e-caller and is a great choice if you need maximum volume for mile-high migrators and plenty of battery life for running the call all day and keeping your devices charged up while you’re out there. If you’re hunting a permanent spread the Overkill HD is the way to go and will give you the most power and convenience of any call out there. The only downside of the Overkill HD is that it’s fairly heavy with the two batteries, so it can be more to deal with if you’re walking in or having problems getting in the field. The Snomad is a great choice for most guys looking for an e-caller with great volume and clarity capabilities in a compact package, and guys on a budget because it’s really affordable. The Snomad is a lot lighter weight than the Overkill HD which makes carrying into the fields much easier. Sometimes you can’t get into a field with a truck or full-bodies, but if each guy carries in a bag of windsocks you can get a pretty decent spread setup and have a great hunt. The Snomad fits well into that kind of run-and-gun style of hunting. Having less gear, being mobile, and being able to get into fields other guys can’t sometimes will be the difference in a successful hunt, or even being able to hunt at all. We’re excited to provide e-caller options that fit into both styles of hunting and helping guys be successful no matter what conditions they encounter.

SR: How does the Snows Down Low e-caller app work? What was the inspiration behind it?

Thies: The Hunt Snows app is something we’ve been working with for a few years now. The first idea for an app was because Apple was restrictive on allowing MP3 downloads to phones. Their operating system just doesn’t allow it. So we had a lot of problems getting guys their MP3 downloads on iPhones, and not everybody has a computer. So we wanted to make an easy way for snow goose tracks to be available on iPhones first, but of course Android was always a goal as well. So really having tracks easily available for iOS users was a determining factor in the overall idea of an app. All of our tracks are available for purchase in the app in addition to the two free tracks we include exclusively in the app.

We also started thinking of other things an app could do. I knew from my experience as a website developer/programmer that we could manipulate sound through code, and figured we could do some pretty cool things with that ability as well. So we set out to accomplish that and the result of that effort is a free app called “Hunt Snows”, and it’s available for iOS and Android devices. The free app comes with two tracks and gives you basic play/pause and volume control functionality with a single e-caller player, and you can purchase additional tracks through the app. We wanted the app to be easy to use first and foremost. Sometimes it can be difficult to adjust phone volume with gloves on, or while trying to be hidden, or whatever. So we made the app with big buttons so you can adjust the volume on the touch screen, pretty much without looking, and it changes quickly. You can set the master volume with your phone, and the app will run between 0-100 percent of the set volume of your phone.

The “E-Caller Pro” upgrade option gives you really cool features with included exclusive “pro” tracks, an additional e-caller player, and advanced sound options that function independently in each e-caller player. With the DualPlayer you can custom mix the tracks you have available in the app to have one track playing at whatever volume you want, and then you can mix in another track and play it at a different volume, blending the tracks to create the perfect sound for the conditions you’re hunting in. Also, you can change the sound balance from left to right in each player. The app gives you the tools to easily and completely control the sound coming out of your e-caller. And it works with most e-callers as well, as long as you can connect your phone to it. It’s pretty cool.

SR: What makes Snows Down Low unique from all the other e-caller companies on the market?

Thies: There are a couple of things that are very important to us: commitment to quality and commitment to customer service. We definitely try to do everything really well and I think that appeals to our customers. We have a strong commitment to quality that has been ingrained into me for the past 30 years, even well before Snows Down Low. We build everything with the utmost quality and best practices that we can. I was an automotive and diesel mechanic for many years. I worked side-by-side with my dad who was among the top echelon of ASE World-Class Certified mechanics at the time. He taught me the right way to do things and the theories that made things work. He taught me how to be meticulous and how to pay attention to the smallest details. He taught me to do the best that I possibly can, and that all persists into everything we do here at Snows Down Low.

We also deeply appreciate our customers. We’ll be on social media responding to messages and be on the phone 10-12 hours per day at times, answering questions and making sure our customers are taken care of and ready to have a successful hunt. I don’t want to make it sound like there aren’t other companies doing this – other companies are doing an amazing job at customer service – and we feel that we are right there with them in that top tier of companies in the outdoor industry who genuinely care about their customers. We’re fortunate for our incredible customers, and sincerely appreciate their support over the past several years.

We also have fresh ideas and innovations in development that are pretty revolutionary, some of which are inspired by time spent as a mechanic and also as a programmer. We’re trying to stay innovative and keep coming up with ways for people to continue being successful hunting snow geese.

SR: With such a poor hatch last year, what’s your outlook on the snow goose hunting this year? 

Thies: Yeah, 2018’s hatch was pretty bad for much of the mid-continent population, which are the birds we see mostly through the Midwest and down into Arkansas, etc. I was at Squaw Creek NWR in northwest Missouri on Christmas Day 2018 and we did see quite a few young birds around. It was relatively warm for that time of year, and plenty of open water. When I look back at photos taken that day there were a lot of young birds, which was somewhat encouraging.

Spring 2019 was pretty much a bust, and it didn’t help with all the weather and flooding, it was horrible. Once the winter weather broke, which unfortunately brought all the precipitation and flooding along with the geese, there were an estimated 2,000,000 light geese staged up, roosting on corn and grain-laden floodwater between SE Nebraska, SW Iowa and NW Missouri. Perfect conditions for migrating snow geese, but snow goose hunting doesn’t matter with all of the weather and flooding. Even if a guy wanted to, you couldn’t get to the birds – there was nothing you could do about it. The flooding along the Missouri River is still bad. It breaks my heart to drive through there and see the devastation and loss. There is still a lot of flooding along the Missouri River, and that will certainly have some continued effect on migration and hunting along and north/south of that migration corridor.

2019 has reports of a better hatch, but survival rates were reported to be somewhat low due to weather. We’re still seeing a higher juvenile percentage compared to 2018 and we’re already seeing better hunting conditions and successful days early in the 2019 season.

Decent juvenile bird population ratios in southbound migrating flocks are a different story though once birds reach the wintering grounds and colonies intermix. The fall migration tends to be smaller, more spread out flocks, whereas the spring migration can bring flocks of 100,000 birds migrating through an area at once. There could be many different families or even entire small colonies all in one flock and that particular mixture of birds can have a big effect on the overall juvenile bird ratio. The adult birds know the game and they’re not interested in much else other than getting back north. The young birds tend to be more willing to see decoys and want to take a look; to peel out of the flock and bring others with them; that’s why hunters love them so much.

Whether there is a bad hatch like 2018 or an abundance of young birds like 2017, to be successful you still have to do all of the common sense things like have an excellent hide, proper placement of decoys, stay still, don’t wear shiny sunglasses… things like that. But with the young birds, they do tend to be more forgiving of our errors and will tilt the odds in your favor a bit more. Overall I think 2019/2020 will be a pretty good season. Let’s hope the weather cooperates!

SR: What’s the biggest difference between killing snow geese and any other type of waterfowl? 

Thies: One big difference is in the hunting pressure snow geese receive. They’re hunted 9 months out of the year. They never get a break. The second they hit the Canadian prairie they’re hunted, and it doesn’t stop until they cross back over that tree-line again. They’ve seen it all, and some of the birds are 20-30 years old. That’s tough.

Also the average flock size in the spring and how they work the decoys is different. Flock sizes are in the thousands, and they’ll work you vertical and circle several times looking for something, anything wrong. Their heads are constantly craning back and forth trying to find something. And it’s not just one or two. It’s thousands of them doing it at the same time. You definitely have to be on top of your game to be consistently successful.

SR: If you were to give advice to someone trying to get into snow goose hunting, what would it be? 

Thies: Try going along with people who are experienced to help out with the learning curve. Snow goose hunting has a price to play, between calls, and the spread and whatnot. By the time you figure decoys, e-callers, and everything else, you’re looking at a few grand for something that would be fairly successful most of the time, so it’s quite an investment. When you get an invitation to go, show up early, help out with everything you can. Work harder than everybody else. Hunt safe and be respectful and you’ll probably get invited back again. Just keep working towards your goals. Learn, watch, and build up your gear to help contribute to everyone else’s success.

Also, spend time scouting and observing the birds. There is a lot to be learned by watching and listening.

SR: What makes snow goose hunting such a fun sport for you?

Thies: It’s an incredible experience to hunt waterfowl in general. When they’re coming in and they’re cupping up and all of that; but when you’re hunting snow geese, especially in the Spring, everything is amplified to another level and it’s quite challenging. When you get under that “big spin”, you have a huge flock of snow geese stacked up to the sky, a tornado of snow geese circling all around as high as you can see. They get closer and lower with each pass, just building the anticipation even more. Then you get the shot call. There’s a barrage of guns going off, hopefully, people are hitting things, and that adrenaline I think is what hooks people. I don’t think there’s that type of experience with anything else on this planet. It’s quite a rush to have the birds decoying in your face like that in a big tornado.

SR: What’s been your most memorable hunt?

Thies: My favorite hunts are with military guys. They bring something to the hunt that is really special. They always seem to have instant camaraderie and a great sense of humor. If I could choose one group of people to hunt with for the rest of my life it would be veterans because it’s just awesome to offer that experience to them and to hear the stories they have. It’s sobering to hear about the sacrifices they’ve made for this country, and that their families have made as well. And I mean, people will tell them “thank you for your service” and that’s great, but until you sit with them and hear about what they went through in the desert, IED bombs, EFP explosives, where it’s just molten pieces of copper ripping through the armored vehicle and it’s just horrifying to think about what these guys did and have gone through, and that they did it willingly for us here in America. Just being near those guys and taking them hunting is incredible. Those are my favorite types of hunts. There is one that stands out though, which is a kind of a funny story.

We had this veteran out and it was early February; a nice migration day and about 9:00 in the morning we had a big migrator flock come by that had probably been feeding together somewhere not too far away. They come over, and we were hunting this land/water spread, and they start setting up into a tornado. The veteran is like “WOOH! THIS IS AWESOME!” and it was great to see him experience that. So the birds keep spinning and keep coming in, and they started doing this double, reverse vortex thing which was actually pretty darn cool. There must have been several thousand in this one flock. Eventually, there’s this huge wall of snow geese that got low and balled up so we call the shot and rip into them. Guns are empty, some cheering going on and we’re reloading, but this guy is over there just dropping shells all over the floor of the blind! His adrenaline is so jacked he can’t even hold on to his shotgun shells. He had to sit down because his knees were shaking so bad because of the adrenaline rush of that snow goose flock coming in, circling lower and lower for over 10 minutes until they got close enough to shoot. He was just like “I need to sit down, I can’t even load my gun”. Just done for. It probably took him a good 15 minutes to recover from that one! That’s probably my most memorable hunt so far, and it was an awesome time. Definitely glad to have had that opportunity.